Thread: A Must Read

Dear yhlc,

whilest I certainly don't believe all muslims are terrorists it was hard not to notice muslim communities literally dancing and celebrating in the streets of Sydney and Melbourne after 9/11. Similarly after Bali. That sure shows support for the barbaric actions taken by madmen. That is not only treason against your adoptive country but treason against humanity pal and should be treated accordingly.
In addition, do muslims really think they can rape our women in the street because they thought they deserved it due to how they were dressed...as was the case in Sydney a few years ago?

You say that IF I am a Christian that I should integrate....yeah right, like you're here out of the goodness of the Australian people, that means you integrate to our way of life not the other way around, and has nothing whatsoever to do with if I'm a Christian or not. Do muslims think Christians should sit on their hands while these murderous dogs blow up people in the street? Do muslims truely believe you have more right to this country than we who allowed you to come do, as quoted by one of the muslim leaders here in Melbourne?

Please correct me if I'm wrong but Islam also states the following...would you care to comment? The politically correct gutless TV reporters never bring these issues up when interviewing Islamic leaders.

1/Fight and slay the pagans (infidels) wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war.
Quran, Sura 9:5

2/Prophet, make war on unbelievers and hypocrites, and deal rigorously with them.
Al Tawbah (The Repentence) Sura 9:73

3/Let not the unbelievers think they will ever get away. They have not the power to do so. Muster against them all the men and cavalry at your command, so that you may strike terror into the enemy of God and your enemy... Prophet, (Muhammed) rouse the faithful to arms! If they (the non-Muslims) incline to peace (accept Islam) make peace with them.
Al Anfal (The Spoils) Sura 8:59

4/If they reject your judgement, know that it is Allah's wish to scourge them for their sins.
Al Maidah (The Table) Sura 5:49

5/Believers (Muslims), take neither Jews nor Christians to be your friends: they are friends with one another. Whoever of you seeks their friendship shall become one of their number, and God does not guide (those Jewish and Christian) wrong-doers.
Al Maidah (The Table) Sura 5:51-5:74


You don't know me or my family and yet according to some of your leaders in Australia and the Quran say it's ok to kill us. Please correct me if I'm wrong here yhlc.

As your Quran says, we are at war, it's just that the politically correct band wagon doesn't know it yet; but I dare say they'll know it soon enough if and when the threats made on MY country by madmen in the name of god have their way.

tony,

i wasn't dancing! i was shocked and so were many other muslims. what do u have to say about that? it's up to individual to do what they want.

is it ok to kill you? here are teh words of the prophet of islam and relevant hadith (compilation of the sayings of the prophet):

"He who believes in God and the Last Day should honour his guest, should not harm his neighbour, should speak good or keep quiet." (Bukhari, Muslim)

"Whoever hurts a Non-Muslim citizen of a Muslim state hurts me, and he who hurts me annoys God." (Bukhari)

"He who hurts a Non-Muslim citizen of a Muslim state, I am his adversary, and I shall be his adversary on the Day of a Judgement." (Bukhari)

"Beware on the Day of Judgement; I shall mysefl be complainant against him who wrongs a Non-Muslim citizen of a Muslim state or lays on him a responsibility greater than he can bear or deprives him of anything that belongs to him." (Al-Mawardi)

"Anyone who kills a Non-Muslim who had become our ally will not smell the fragrance of Paradise." (Bukhari)

there are peopel who are racist in this country. does that make australia a racist nation or australians racist?

regarding integration, i said everybody shoudl integrate. takes 2 hands to clap tony. u know that. point is, it's already happening. we had symposiom with a rabbi, mima, priest and preacher last week in brisbane. it was great. the islamic reasearch centre and multi faith centre at griffith university nathan campus (brisbane) is funded by the government to promote integration of relgiions. it's headed by muslim professor and he works very closely with a jew. still, more needs to be done even though the media won't like it.

regarding teh quranic verses, i don't want ot insult your intelligence. please type "online quran" in google, go check the verses and tafsirs (transliteration- not translation). read:

1. the verses BEFORE and AFTER the ones you have stated
2. read teh transliteration
3. decide for yourself.
4. ensure that what you have pasted above is the CORRECT translation - there have been mayn instances where false translations have been provided.

if u are lazy like me , then check out teh faq on the link below which includes teh issues you have raised.

http://www.drzakirnaik.com/pages/qanda/index.php

also:

http://www.themodernreligion.com/ter...sm_verses1.htm

thanks for stating ur concern. my offer is still open to call me on 0405 830 636 but please call me after u check the above 2 links out first.

i agree with your political correctness gone wrong statment. i think it's ludicrous.

let me make it very clear, i have stand up christians when they are being criticsed bcos my religion clearly states that christians are the people of the book/bible/biblos and are believers in one god, jesus, moses, and all the other prophets.

might want to read this too:

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117...-13762,00.html

i dont think a child shoudl be forced to sing a christmas carol but at the same time, it is wrong to curse a religion or anything for that matter.

just a suggestion and assuming u have read the first 2 linsk i have sent u,

why not confront those muslims who celebrate the death of innocent people with what you have picked up today?

and once u get ur reply, ask them why didn't the prophet destroy mecca when he returned with an army from medina? why did he forgave the people who were oppressing and tortuing their own people who accepted islam?

after all, he did have an army that was very powerful. he also had alliance with jews and christians and at that time, even the jews and christians had their beef with the pagans.

i hope u don't get the feeling that i am "telling" u what to do. just a suggestion.

face fire with water and watch it disintegrate.

sword of islam:

http://www.al-sunnah.com/sword.htm

I think it's ok for people to have a right to express their opinion on the forum.

I know it's not Islam that is the problem, the islamic scriptures are all out against violence and terrorism. The problem is Fundamentalistic interpretation of those scriptures.

Unfortunately, I live in a country that has dealt with arabs for a long time and as much as I hate to say it... In spite of what the scriptures say, MOST people in islamic cultures do not value equality of gender and race and peace between religions and ideologies or even common sense. From my experience their morals are twisted; law that is strict and violent with trespassers (of rules some of which are stupid) is not seen as immoral, while marrying 3 women, treating them worse than goats and throw them out in the street when you please is allowed. Even Dictators such as Gaddaffi collect money for the holy war and want all males to take military training just in case. (Mind, most Libyans actually hate their leader).

Proof of this is everywhere to be seen... I sincerely feel sorry for the true peace loving Muslims who are judged similarly to their Fundamentlist brothers. These are people that the media doesn't talk about, much less defends.

And it's these peaceful Muslims' duty to take action against this violence first... not the US army. It's a shame how quickly some ***** can brainwash a mass of people to hate other... something both fundametalist islams and this colonell are guilty of.

I have nothing against Muslims, but I'm totally against twisted morals.
In the same way that I have nothing against Jehovah Witnesses but I'm against the mother who refuses blood transfusion to save her daughter and I totally hate door to door preachers.
And I have nothing against Catholics but I'm totally against having Dogmas that MUST be believed, and I hate the atrocities done by the inquisition.
And I have nothing against Germans, But I disapprove the Nazist philosophy and I hate the fact I never grasped the language.

Ultimately we are all children of the same universe/god. Let us not hate when we can love but we must defend this love from blood thirsty people whoever they are. Such people only deserve hate in return... they should reap what they sow.

I do agree that the US and many US Allies have an agenda to make Muslims look bad in order to eliminate them for their own ends... Much like hitler did to the Jews. But on the other hand I have personal experience dealing with Muslims and I have to say that I don't trust them one bit, one muslim less will not hurt anybody... I won't be killing anyone unless I really have to defend myself, but to be honest I am pleased someone will be wiping out those damned terrorists.

The makes my blod boil. In my contry the politics are so naive and stupid. In the name of political correctness they are villingly ignorant of the situation with the muslim terrorists. I agree that France (sadly) will go down the toilet during the next years. I guess it will be a civial war within a few years.
I have NO respect for the imans and spirital leaders in islam. They are full of #!* and lie to the west about the "peaceful islam" while they are telling their followers to hate jews and kill americans. It is ok to lie as a muslim IF it will benefit the cause of islam.
Why do they have to go to US and western contries? Their leaders preach over and over again against the bad moral standards in the western contries. Hey, move to another muslim contry then!
Here you are free to beat you wife and kill anybody that convert to a different religion.

Check out the books of Mark Gabriel, a former imam. He has something interesting to tell....

I had no intention of stirring up a hornet's nest. I wasn't even arguing. I was just presenting facts to make us aware of where we stand. My purpose was to make us aware that extremists like Osama bin Laden and his ilk intend to take control of the world and change it into their image unless they are stopped. The fact that they are Muslims may be coincidental. But the fact is, they are Muslim. I really do not know any Muslims and would be considerate and kind to them if they wanted to live in peace beside me. But i am not open to having extremists take over my wonderful country and take my hard won freedom. All mankind longs for freedom, and we here in America, as well as many other countries have fought ing, hard, bloody wars to preserve it. I think a great portion of the world feels the same way, as we are having a severe border problem as a result of illegals trying to slip in. And the sad thing is that many of these are terrorists trying to get in to disrupt out way of life.

I don't even think it is a religious issue. I think it's a human issue. It always has been and probably always will be. But as long as we are vigilant wherever we live, we are prepared to combat that that would steal our lives.

I apologize if I offended anyone. But as far as I can see facts are facts and we gain nothing by ignoring them.

Hz

wacky,

i feel the same at times but at the end of the day, all i am suggesting for people's sake is to differentiate between religion and culture. it's 2 separate things.

i have had personal experience iwth chritians and agnostics which left me with a bad impression. what should i do now? hate all christians or agnostics and save things like "one less christian will not hurt anybody"? is that the civilised thing to say?

diffe,

stop being an ignorant and go listen to a friday sermons and tell me if the sermons talk about killing non-muslims, etc.

u're just making ur own life miserable by believing this nonsenese. there are are some imams who spread hate but generalising gets u no where. they are far and few between.

i know for a fact that all the mosques in brisbane and the one gold coast promote integration and we are taught to look in the mirror if we feel that we are being trageted for no reason.

don't need to be a muslim to beat ur own wife. are u telling me that non-muslims don't beat their wives either? i know in australia there are over 60,000 cases at min. UNREPORTED every year. what do u say about that?

the government is spending millions on ads this christmas season to encorage abused women to come out of the closet.

diffe, where in the quran of hadith does it say it is ok to lie as a muslim? we aren't even allowed to lie as a joke!

had to edit here bcos i feel what i have said is a bit harsh and im sorry to those who have read the unedited portion.

what is the difference between those muslims who justify their killings against non-muslims and those non-muslims who use statemetns such as "the only good muslim, is a dead muslim". it all starts with an intention.

those who subscribe to anti-muslim sentiments should expect the same in return. is this an unfair statement?

if u are going to hate msulims, have teh guts to go to a mosque, voice ur opinion and also have teh decency to listen to the reply.

what's happening in france is wrong from both sides. france has picked on muslims specifically. even american history and the history of the rest of teh world has shown that if u take away one's liberty, then there will be repercussions.

the USA was found on teh basis of libery and freedom. it's in teh constitution. those were teh true christians.

hzchoice,

u can bet that muslims are on jihad (struggle) against the terrorists (muslims and non-muslims). only thing, teh rules of war has been de-civilised ie, ok to kill innocents via smart bombs, nerve gas, missiles, etc and label them as "collaterla damage".

bcos of this it is impossible to get these bastards without hurting innocent so the only thing we can do is voice our opinion and educate those on the "Dark side".

it takes time but for those who believe in god, it's a matter of "when" and not "if".

the reality is and this goes unreported bcos it's not news worthy, there are people who have left these groups and are now exposing the lies of these terrorists to curb recruitment.

it's happening within the muslims world, israel (Refusniks), the US army ( i think the term is deserters), russia, serbia, south africa, china, south america and all other organisation and nations who find excuse to kill innocent people in the name of freedom, patriotism, nationalism and religion.

it's gonna happen but it's gonna take longer if those who are against terrorism just idly sit by or dissolve into groups.

the right thing to do is to integrate, learn and work together as "mankind" - not divide and get concurred.