Thread: The Trial on the Marsdens & their PI Inc business in Malaysia

It may be a wrong decision but after a serious debate, it is a hard, cold and unpopular decision we as Admins, have to make in light of many behind the scenes facing uncomfortable and intimidating challenges... even to the point of almost losing server accessibility... thanks to Democracy and transparent free welcoming open doors we still maintain to this day. That causes members to infiltrate among us all and create chaos and stealing databases for which, our DB was compromised by many being spammed with details, informations, promotions and theft of our feedbacks that Batty went personally to cover. Again, your donations made it possible and it truly paid off with almost $25 dollars left to see him safely home last weekend. $25, $250 or 750 to $2500 is certainly miserable to modest but definitely, inadequate to cover many more anticipated trials to come. We ought to be looking at a safe margin, like when we first estimated, $4K - $5K to cover many trials when scheduled.


We urge you to consider, now that the trial has eventually begun, to help the costs with your kind donations. We also request that you DO NOT share this privilege report, that we mailed you in advance of the majority of members. You deserve this privilege feedback, you made it possible against the backdrop of many who rather preferred YOU DONATE while they lay back... some as jeering and mocking our efforts with various forms of cynical posts just to prove their point about their righteous ego and statements as a make-believe support to the Marsdens (which we personally don't see it taking place at all), because if you are truly a supporter of this fact-finding cause, irrespective of who is right or wrong, YOU show by active support with the donation to the cause, which is to gather the facts as it is produced and/or obtained. We stand together on this despite us being on either divide on the Marsdens we may haqve once looked up very much. Those who are filled with "hot air" only, they are far from any genuine cause... which you clearly differentiate from them with your donation.

For a start, we will release the information at a later stage through the Forum but YOU all get to see & read from the front row seat first & foremost. It may gradually be restricted for release each and every time and, only to the Donors who literally help support the funding. If any of you are seriously with or into Investments, you know how it works, shareholders get to taste the slice of the profit first & foremost, NOT the public.

The funds gathered since our last email appeal reached our target as was hoped, but only to cover the next trial visit of 2-3days only.

Should we have had $5,000 as we once calculated, we won't need to ask or remind and plead for more donations like we have been for the past 17 months ... but we have to. For all along, we never reached the expected sum we preferred to have to be set aside as standby for any sudden event or at short notice. This is somewhat stressful but we are not complaining... We WILL... however, should YOU let those out there and in most countries where disgruntled ex-Pipsters might take the news after this for free which is a slap in our face as yours are too, for them to be doing short or less to nothing with donations. Worst still, they may even go elsewhere to claim through another Forum, that their prize information was based on "their" own findings... it has been done before and will still be done again... only you can help reduce that from happening, we count on you to disallow & prevent it from happening again.


Visit the Forum and give your views please... its the only humble way to show your gratitude and appreciation for Batty to take the extra mile on all our behalf...

There is light for those who wish to recover $$$s and after this successful delivery by first hand information delivered, the new batch of donors will need to donate through PayPal instead. This way, it makes my administration a lot more easier too to mail out. Other means are giving me a tennis arm with the mouse clicks ever since.

Donate through your PayPal is the best way after this. Please add your RC username is all I ask of you, thank you again for your generosity and kind support shown since we began the Donation Fund drive.

This is the latest measure we have to implement to secure the update of court events gathered and to be emailed to all our honorable Donors. If you donate, and fail to agree to this measure by ignoring or not heeding, thats fine, It will NOT be sent to you. To receive it ahead of the Forum membership, you need to post your donation confirmation together with the text here below in the quoted box to us Admins, so we can have a separate list of our Honorable Donors who will get the privilege of receiving first hand , ALWAYS!!!

They donated to the cause, their genuine support deserves to be recognized, first & foremost.

We bring you the long awaited Trial report. This is just the start, we have also been hearing that all too often since last year resulting from the Courts manner and method of conducting court cases with a good portion of blame to be pointed at the previous Defense Lawyer.




The Admins – ROLClub Forum

We have managed to receive past the $750 target even though the safe estimate on a short term rests at $1000, we asked and hope $750 to be reached which we did in under 17 days... this means, it is attainable.

Please continue if you can & will, donate again in the coming days or weeks as your donation now has a purpose and a goal and we are heading in that direction rather positively with every optimism. The Judge, the trial schedules and the court locations are finally organized to see this through... and it will pan out for some time to come given the amount of documents tendered. They are just a start frankly speaking, after noting the events that took place on Thursday.

There is light for those who wish to recover $$$s and after this successful delivery by first hand information delivered, the new batch of donors will need to donate through PayPal instead. This way, it makes my administration a lot more easier too to mail out. Other means are giving me a tennis arm with the mouse clicks ever since.

Donate through your PayPal is the best way after this. Please add your RC username is all I ask of you, thank you again for your generosity and kind support shown since we began the Donation Fund drive.

This is the latest measure we have to implement to secure the update of court events gathered and to be emailed to all our honorable Donors. If you donate, and fail to agree to this measure by ignoring or not heeding, thats fine, It will NOT be sent to you. To receive it ahead of the Forum membership, you need to post your donation confirmation together with the text here below in the quoted box to us Admins, so we can have a separate list of our Honorable Donors who will get the privilege of receiving first hand , ALWAYS!!!

We shall also appreciate that you use your same PayPal/LR acct address to email to us at >>:
[email protected] and [email protected] with this text here below added (in bold RED) :

"I accept receiving your email updates, by keeping me informed on the Malaysian Trial Updates on The Marsdens. My donation for the Fund is testimony of my approval on ROLClub's mail & trial coverage as updates you send to my email address which is>>: (replace this text with your Email address)."

This is a new emergency measure we have to implement as a result of someone, or more, among the current donors, that have persistently complain about us to be spamming their MBox despite their donations (all it takes perhaps is a small contributed sum to make it look as a donation) and as a free-lunch bonus again, he/she or they, have access to privilege court coverage feedbacks and then slam us with little costs or no efforts to nothing to ruin our Forum service and existence.

We are trying to eliminate this current/future threat through these varmints who has not given up as yet. Your cooperation and understanding will vindicate you from the suspected ones. We don't suspect the generous Donors but more on the smallish sum Donors but we cannot be too sure however, this new and necessary implementation will reduce the current threat and to remove their presence among us sooner than later, so help us achieve it and to secure your fair right to the feedbacks gathered by Batty.

Those who donated to the cause by their genuine support deserves to be recognized & served, first & foremost.

We have here, the report on the long awaited Trial. This is just and only the start before many more. We have also been hearing this all too often since last year resulting from the Courts manner and method of conducting court cases while a good portion of blame was to be pointed at the previous Defense Lawyer.


The Admins – ROLClub Forum

Click HEREfor Batty's pics while covering the October Trial

Trial on the Marsdens – Seremban Courts, Malaysia.

Seremban Oct 09, 2008. – by Moderator, theBat$.

Trial 9-10-08 (Day 1 - Morning)

8.00am - Arrived at my usual time. Check the notices on the board.

8.30am - Was told by the Court Official to come at 9.15am. No PRESS or Media present.

8.55am - Back to court. The prosecutors were there already. They were engrossed with checking their paperwork and documents.

9.05am - BM and SM was led into court in handcuffs. (see description)

- Court packed today. There were many people entering by now. All of them are ethnic Indians, they are here to watch 4 of them stand trial for robbery.

9.17am - Crowd getting restless, still no judge yet. SM and BM also uneasy and having a deep conversation, SM starts crying.

9.25 - A lawyer comes in, false alarm. He represents the robbery gang.

9.30 - SM's crying and a court official comes to talk to her. They say they don't know who is coming and nobody has been to see them in prison.

10.15am - Judge comes in. Court is in Session.

- First case, robbery.

10.25am - Next case in turn, The Marsdens. The respective parties introduce themselves. BM and SM have 2 lawyers working on pro bono and there are the two prosecutors. Their lawyers just made it in a nick of time, just 5 minutes before the judge showed up. The prosecutors announced that they will be calling, for a start, 5 witnesses. But they have yet to show up.

10.45am - Judge calls for short recess until the witnesses arrive.

11.20am - Recess over, court resumes session. First witness is called. She is from the registrar of companies (SSM). The prosecutor asks the witness to tell the court her position and function in the SSM. She checks and processes the paperwork for Corporations. The prosecutor then tenders a slew of documents regarding the formation of Pic Capital. He establishes that the company’s addresses were changed several times and who the directors of the company were.

(tediously, document after document was tendered, explained, verified and labeled into evidence)

- In cross examination, the Defense question the documents regarding the incorporation of the company. The lawyer for the defense then asked the witness, who delivered the papers to the SSM? Did BM himself walk on his own two legs there and handed it in? On the document, the name of a company providing secretarial services appear as the one who lodge the papers. The lawyer implies that it was that company that should be responsible for any inaccuracies.

- The Defense also established the fact that prior to 2004, there was no mention of BM or SM as director of Pic Capital. How can they be hold accountable for its action? The lawyer moves on to question the witness, is it illegal for a company to change its address? The witness replies: if it complies with the law, no. So the answer is 'No'? "Yes", the witness replies. (amusing scene).

- Second witness is called, also a lady and from SSM. The prosecutor proceeds to establish the set up of New Mark Business Center and also put across that the company had not submitted their annual returns and statement of accounts.

- In cross examination by BM's lawyer, the lawyer ask the witness if she can prove without any doubt that BM had done what the prosecutors have claimed, and the document is not sitting in some file somewhere. “You only say that it is not here because you do not have it with you (the documents were tendered into evidence by the prosecution)”. The lawyer then grilled the witness on the procedure to file the returns.

- Defense request that this witness be recalled at a further date. Witness responded unsure if BM had delivered the documents.

12.45pm - Judge calls for court to recess until 2.30pm.

Trial 9-10-08

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Here are the observations I made during the two dates.
Thursday Observation
-----------

- BM looks a bit worse for wear than the last time, maybe sick?

- SM looks about the same, visibly depressed.

- Both wearing blue prison garbs.

- SM is prone to bouts of crying and is seen leaning on BM

- However, they seem to be in better spirits when their lawyers
show up.

- Their lawyers appears credible and put up a good case.

Trial 10-10-08

Friday Observation
-----------

- BM and SM listening to the trial intently with the help of an interpreter.

- SM seemed much happier today, evident from her smiles.

- BM and SM was seen whispering when the 4th witness was being questioned.

- BM looked like he remembered something as the evidence was read out.

- They seem more confident about their case.

- BM wears glasses throughout the trial.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%



Trial 9-10-08 (Day 1 – Afternoon)

2.45pm - Trial resumes, judge sets 4.00pm to end the trial. Prosecution calls 3rd witness. Who is also from SSM. The prosecution establishes the fact that Pic Capital formerly was another company.

(Again, tediously, document after document was tendered, explained, verified and labelled into evidence)

- The chain of documents tendered showed the transition from company A to B, B to C, C to D until finally Pic Capital.
Five changes all together. They also established the directors and changes to the companies.

- In cross-examination, the Defence question the witness about company changing names, to the witnesses knowledge, is it illegal? She, from SSM, said she didn't understand the question. After much prompting she relented and said "No, it was not illegal."

- Next, the witness was asked about Picpay. The prosecution tendered the documents and such. It was revealed that BM owned 26% stake in PicPay, SM owned 25% and Pure Investor Dot Com held the balance of 49%. Then the witness was told to read Picpay's object clause. It included online business, consulting etc. There were three items but she only read two of them. This was to come back and bite her.

- In the cross examination that followed,

Lawyer for the Defendant (LOD)

Witness for Prosecution (WFP)

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

LOD: Is this the document you are reading from? (raise up document)

WFP: Yes, it is.

LOD: If something is written here, it is considered legal and binding?

WFP: I don't understand.

LOD: There are 3 articles for the object clause but you read only two.

WFP: I can read it again. (Looks embarrassed)

LOD: What I want to know is, if you did not read it, is it considered not valid?

WFP: No.

LOD: So everything in this document is in effect?

WFP: Yes. (Witness reads the missing article)

(Missing clause showed Picpay intended to trade share, stocks and debentures)

LOD: If (see above) it is illegal, why did the SSM allow the company to be registered?

- The defence lawyer then asked,

LOD: If a company does illegal activities are all the directors liable?

WFP: I don't understand.

LOD: Let's say if a company does illegal activities, should one or all the directors be responsible?

WFP: (answered something vaguely)

LOD: Are the directors liable under LAW?

WFP: Yes. (reluctantly)

- On a roll, the lawyer makes a blunder by asking about Picpay's directors instead of Pic Capital. He realized he goofed at this and abruptly recoiled and quickly shuts up by his embarrassed give away.. He was trying to establish the fact that Pic Capital had other directors before BM, but instead made a case for the prosecution!

- Judge calls it a day! Asked the defence to have their "paperwork" in order before coming to trial. Earlier they complained that the documents given by the prosecution was not in order. Today 50 documents were tendered into evidence! The judge spoke: “will there be any more?” The prosecution responded, "Yes, more to come." She grimaced. Court is adjourned until 9.30am following day.

- End of DAY 1 Court Trial Attendance -

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Trial 9-10-08 (Day 2 – Morning)

8.30am - Arrived at court complex and had breakfast there. Then I spent the remaining time to write the report from my notes and put things in order. I had already started it last night and there was a lot of things to remember.

9.30am - Enter the courthouse, everybody was there and waiting for the trial to start. Judge arrives 10 minutes later. Then the trial began. The prosecutor called for the 4th witness to take the stand.

- A Malay man with a local bank's Central Communication, Payment and Transaction Manager. He was sent from HQ in KL. The prosecutor begins by having the witness explain his duties as the manager of his dept and the function of the documents. His duties include overseeing the daily transfer operation. First he gave a briefing on funds transfer link TT and SWIFT.

- SWIFT stands for Society for World Inter-bank Financial Telecommunications. A messaging system for banks and the like for the purpose of funds transfer.

- The prosecution then informs the court that it will be tendering documents regarding money transfers (SWIFT Transaction) numbering 50! This is not including supplementary documents. The prosecution then ask the witness about the transactions and establish the contents of the documents. He proceeds to take the court thru item by item in the contents of the documents.

- From the documents, it was established that large sums of money were transfered from HSBC to a local banks in Nilai. The request was made by Pure Investor to New Mark. After the order is is used the money goes thru a US based bank before being released by the witness's department to the local bank in Nilai. Funds are converted from USD to Ringgit and back into USD for the purpose! (no wonder so many fees!)

After 12 such tendering, the judge stops the prosecution.

DPP - Deputy Public Prosecutor

Judge : Are you going to continue like that until all 50 transaction have been done?

DPP : Yes.

Judge : I think if we continue at this pace, it will take hours. (she is more amused than irritated, everybody laughs)

- Just for the 12 submission alone the amount transferred from Pure Investor to New Mark Business Center is a whopping US$1 million over.(11-08-2003 to 04-02-2004), there are 50 transaction! The last 2 (49,50) were listed as "Bryan Bonus and Salary" but the amount was not revealed.

- Judge suggest the evidence be compiled into a table form for easy reference while the documents were submitted straight into evidence. Prosecutors and the defense agree. The judge then ask if the defense would like to cross examine the witness further. The prosecution replied that in the interest of speeding up the case they will ask a few more question.

- In the cross examination that followed,

Lawyer for the Defendant (LOD)

Witness for Prosecution (WFP)


LOD: First of all, I just want to say that I mean no disrespect.

WFP: Okay.

LOD: Can you tell the court your highest qualification?

WFP: (taken aback a bit) SPM*

*High School certificate

LOD: Are you qualified to be managing the department?

Judge : Where are you going with this? Relevance?

LOD: I mean no offense, I was giving him a chance to reveal if he had taken any specialize courses in banking.

Judge : (looking at the witness) Have you?

WFP: I have been with the bank for 10 years and I know the day to day operations well. So I guess the bank sees potential in me.

Yes, I've attended a few courses here and there.

LOD: Would you say you are qualified to deal with technical problems?

WFP: No, we have IT to deal with any technical problems.

LOD: So would you say your work is administrative?

WFP: If administration you mean overseeing 14 staffs in my dept, then yes.

- The cross examination then turns its attention to SWIFT transaction, which is the system for inter-bank/institution funds transfer.

LOD: Is your job communicating with SWIFT?

WFP: Not exactly.

LOD: Does SWIFT communicate with you?

WFP: Transaction messages and regular updates of new SWIFT members.

LOD: Who is in charge of SWIFT? Is your local bank in charge of SWIFT?

WFP: No. SWIFT is based in Belgium.

LOD: So if a SWIFT message sent to your bank, can you verify the data?

WFP: It is treated as all good.

LOD: So you cannot verify the original message, only what you receive?

WFP: That is correct.

- Defense establish that the local bank is only carrying out instruction received and cannot verify the sender. HSBC is established as the ordering bank.

- Just before adjourning for lunch, the prosecutor got word that the 5th witness cannot be present. All parties then huddled for picking a date. Finally they settled on Nov 26th, just one day to finish up the 5th witness and then set a date for the continuing trial. Today another 50 documents was tendered not including supplementary documents. Total for these two days - 100.

12.45pm - Court is adjourned until the new trial date.

- End of October, DAY 2 Court Trial -