Thread: A Humble Request (Merged)

Well, Livefree, I myself would not answer an inquiry about my credit card from an "email". If they really wanted that information, seems to me the proper route would be written postal mail with perhaps a phone number and specific department/person that you should talk to.

I don't understand why PIPS would credit a member's account with CC funds that had not cleared and PIPS did not actually have the money to invest. How could PIPS be using that money to create ROL if it did not have the actual money to invest? When I wired my money in January, 2005 it was not credited to my account & supposedly earning ROL until 6 weeks later at the end of February. Crediting the CC funds right away to create the illusion that the member was actually earning money when the money was not there looks suspicious to me. Does anyone have an answer?
bigdogs (not Big Dog who I have seen post here)

Originally Posted by bigdogs

I don't understand why PIPS would credit a member's account with CC funds that had not cleared and PIPS did not actually have the money to invest. How could PIPS be using that money to create ROL if it did not have the actual money to invest? When I wired my money in January, 2005 it was not credited to my account & supposedly earning ROL until 6 weeks later at the end of February. Crediting the CC funds right away to create the illusion that the member was actually earning money when the money was not there looks suspicious to me. Does anyone have an answer?
bigdogs (not Big Dog who I have seen post here)

Wire transfers and Credit Card payments do not operate in the same way.

It has been stated that with a Credit Card payment the accounts were opened at once, even though the payments were not received until some 30 days later.

Wire transfer money has to be received and then credited to the account. In some cases, even wire transfer monies were not credited to Pips account but the monies had been sent and never arrived at Pips bank - now where is that money?

Originally Posted by bigdogs

I don't understand why PIPS would credit a member's account with CC funds that had not cleared and PIPS did not actually have the money to invest. How could PIPS be using that money to create ROL if it did not have the actual money to invest? When I wired my money in January, 2005 it was not credited to my account & supposedly earning ROL until 6 weeks later at the end of February. Crediting the CC funds right away to create the illusion that the member was actually earning money when the money was not there looks suspicious to me. Does anyone have an answer?
bigdogs (not Big Dog who I have seen post here)

Conforming to Bryan, PIPS was obligated to put money in our accounts right after the CC payment went thru. So the money showing in our accounts was real:

"Also in answer to the question of why money was in members accounts when we had not been paid, because all transactions run 30 days behind and we were obligated to put the money in member accounts before that time, it was the way the system had always worked."

I find it very hard to believe that any company has any obligation until the funds are physically in their own account.

People that sent money by wire transfer had to wait up to a month until it was confirmed that the funds were credited to PIPS bank account. Why should it be any different for CC companies?

If the CC companies, or processors, confirmed with PIPS that the funds were available and did not pay, then surely they could be held liable.

Perhaps that is, in part, what this investigation is about. To find the missing money and bring those responsible to justice.

Originally Posted by bigdogs

I don't understand why PIPS would credit a member's account with CC funds that had not cleared and PIPS did not actually have the money to invest. How could PIPS be using that money to create ROL if it did not have the actual money to invest? When I wired my money in January, 2005 it was not credited to my account & supposedly earning ROL until 6 weeks later at the end of February. Crediting the CC funds right away to create the illusion that the member was actually earning money when the money was not there looks suspicious to me. Does anyone have an answer?
bigdogs (not Big Dog who I have seen post here)

It was not an illusion...It's no different than if you bought lunch on your credit card. The restuarant is not going to wait for the actual funds from the credit card company before allowing you to eat your food. They are accepting an agreement that if the credit card company authorizes your purchase, the CC company will pay them in real funds within a reasonable time period. If not, then CC's would be useless pieces of plastic. If the CC company doesn't pay the restuarant then the restuarant is still out the dinner you ate and you're not necessarily to blame. Should they track you down and pump your stomach? Now if the reason the CC company didn't pay is due to you doing a chargeback, that is another story altogether.

This having to wait on funds from CC companies is precisely why a lot of small businesses do not accept them. Besides having to pay fees to the CC company banks for accepting cards, they also have to wait 30 to 60 days for the funds to arrive. Most really small businesses can't afford to extend themselves that far. In the case of a multi-billion dollar operation, the operating capital is there to "float" the member's account until the CC company pays up. If the CC company never pays up then the member should be out the account but not necessarily would it be the customer's fault the CC company didn't pay. If the customer issued a chargeback then the account should be null and void but what if they already received money from it?

Now here's the sinister part...A lot of CC companies allow up to 6 mos. for their customers to initiate a chargeback. A lot of people bought accounts with CC's and began withdrawing as soon as possible. Prior to the 6 mos. "grace" period being up they initiated chargebacks...They out and out "stole" lots of money out of Pips without really having to pay anything for it.

I'm sorry if this ran a little long but it helps me to reason it out for my own thinking if I write/type it. Thanks...

Originally Posted by njbth

I find it very hard to believe that any company has any obligation until the funds are physically in their own account.

People that sent money by wire transfer had to wait up to a month until it was confirmed that the funds were credited to PIPS bank account. Why should it be any different for CC companies?

If the CC companies, or processors, confirmed with PIPS that the funds were available and did not pay, then surely they could be held liable.

Perhaps that is, in part, what this investigation is about. To find the missing money and bring those responsible to justice.

Yes, very good point.

And the CC companies, then, "hold" the money until they are "sure" that Pips is worthy in their eyes, while all along the bill is paid by the user, and the Pips money is still held - CC company wins all around.

MY OPINION ONLY: The CC may be looking for a way to justify their "holding" of funds not released to Pips and not returned to the user.......they are only allowed to hold for so long, and they have long exceeded that time frame. Why payout when you can use the money for free????? And will the user get interest from the CC company if the funds have to be returned? How about Pips if it has to be paid?

Depending on how you do your accounting, crediting an account as paid in full would not be extraordinary. Nor would it be to earn, if the company is designed such. The obligation spoken of is a "good faith" obligation (that means BM is being a nice guy to all you Trolls out there) because of the arrangement of the system. If Pips never receives my money, should I have an account? Depends on the company. BM has said "yes", and will honor his end of the bargain (as it stands now). But is it fair to Pips Corp to eat the difference? How do you get around the CC company?

Arcturus

In the midst of waiting to get ordered products from verified merchants, this came from Bryan. I remembered feeling like, "Finally, it's all coming together."

THE LIGHT IS SHINING THROUGH
07-JUL-05
“Hi Everyone,
There has been a lot going on over the past 10 days or so.
1. For those that have tried the credit card payment system you will
have noticed there is a new processor in place. This has been done to
improve the efficiency in processing, reductions in the number of failed
attempts and is available to members in all countries.
2. On withdrawals, we are almost there in resolving the issues that
have been plaguing us for months and members will see a marked
improvement in the completion of withdrawals very soon.
3. The bank in Cambodia is still progressing very well, submissions
have been made and feedback from our people there is that all has been
received very positively. The process of obtaining a licence is a long
and arduous one, but we are getting there.
4. On the legal front, although we do not accept that the 5ytp program
contravenes any regulation in any jurisdiction. On futher legal advice
from our lawyers, we feel that it is prudent for us to suspend the
program for moment. This will enable us to address the issues being
raised by certain jurisdictions over the program. All funds paid into
the program to-date will be put back into members Picpay accounts.
Once we have satisfied the relevant authorities on the legitimacy and
legal issues we will look at the possibilities of re-instigating the
program.
I know this has been a very hard and frustrating time for everyone and
none moreso than ourselves, we have been working extremely hard on
what may to some, appear to be insurmountable issues. We are getting
there, albeit slowly and everyone, members and the companies will
survive to go forward together for many years to come.


I want to personally thank all members for their patience and belief in
what we are doing, faith, integrity and hard work will always prevail.
Please stick with it a little while longer, the light at the end of the
tunnel is growing into a bright beacon.
Bryan”

I think this a very good point and is something to be considered.

I also find it hard to believe CC companies would not have paid and would agree the Investigation in its later stages has to be largely be about missing money.

Originally Posted by njbth

I find it very hard to believe that any company has any obligation until the funds are physically in their own account.

People that sent money by wire transfer had to wait up to a month until it was confirmed that the funds were credited to PIPS bank account. Why should it be any different for CC companies?

If the CC companies, or processors, confirmed with PIPS that the funds were available and did not pay, then surely they could be held liable.

Perhaps that is, in part, what this investigation is about. To find the missing money and bring those responsible to justice.